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Again though, I'm talking about just keeping the country running and not using a shutdown to implement new things. Obama didn't say "DACA or no government."

The real problem is that the shithole states get a massively disproportionate say in the senate, so we have to put up with your racist uncle getting way more input than civilized people. Don't forget that the senate could end this today without trump's approval of the republicans had a spine.
I think part of the problem here is that the Senate could probably pass a bill (potentially even override a veto the longer this goes on), but Trump vetoing it would make him look bad, so Turtle won't do it. So RIP balance of powers.
 
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I think part of the problem here is that the Senate could probably pass a bill (potentially even override a veto the longer this goes on), but Trump vetoing it would make him look bad, so Turtle won't do it. So RIP balance of powers.
100%. The senate already unanimously passed a clean funding bill, but paul ryan blocked it from the house when trump said he didnt like it.
 

GasBandit

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If we have an armed uprising that isn't squelched immediately, it will be because the military also turns against the government, so IDK about that.
There doesn't have to be an "uprising," just an armed resistance to occupation. Shepherds with AK47s and junior chemistry sets kicked us, with all our tanks and stealth bombers and scary nukes, right the fuck out of Iraq. It may not be pretty, but given that I'm sure that the US Military will be 9000% even more reluctant to go scorched earth on US Territory, that an armed resistance can persist long enough to outlast and overcome a true exercise in domestic tyranny - and it most certainly beats the disarmed populace alternative.


And saying we have representatives is fine, except most of the populace just votes for a letter on a page regardless of if the person they are voting for gives 2 shits about them, and then the person they vote for votes in favor of whichever business gives them the most money. So if by representative democracy, you mean Representative Kleptocracy, then sure. ;)
In a democratic process, people get the government they deserve.
 
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figmentPez

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Can't pay your rent because of the shutdown? The US government suggests doing chores for your landlord.
On Thursday, the U.S. Office of Personnel Management tweeted sample letters to help the roughly 800,000 affected workers negotiate with creditors and mortgage companies. One letter, meant for employees to send to their landlords, discussed a temporary reduction in rent payments and further suggests "the possibility of trading my services to perform maintenance (e.g. painting, carpentry work) in exchange for partial rent payments."
 
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There doesn't have to be an "uprising," just an armed resistance to occupation. Shepherds with AK47s and junior chemistry sets kicked us, with all our tanks and stealth bombers and scary nukes, right the fuck out of Iraq. It may not be pretty, but given that I'm sure that the US Military will be 9000% even more reluctant to go scorched earth on US Territory, that an armed resistance can persist long enough to outlast and overcome a true exercise in domestic tyranny - and it most certainly beats the disarmed populace alternative.



In a democratic process, people get the government they deserve.
Those "Shepherds with AK47s and junior chemistry sets" were trained militia - like literally trained in Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Syria, and pre-invasion Iraq by actual military. Iraq had stockpiled caches of arms and explosives for a resistance going back to the Iran-Iraq War. They were able to get support because they were rallying against a foreign invader, which will almost always unite otherwise opposed factions. They were being bankrolled by other nations and regional powers. The local authorities in Iraq were largely underpaid, unmotivated, seen as traitors supporting the foreign invaders, and at constant risk for their lives. We have had occupying forces there for nearly 18 years, a war which is domestically unpopular and expensive and suffered several costly mistakes in the use of private military contractors.

And yet the idea that they "kicked us right the fuck out of Iraq" is for wrong. IS has been losing territory and control steadily in Iraq for years. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-27838034

But sure, imagine that being able to buy an AR-15 will protect you from the US Army.
 

GasBandit

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Those "Shepherds with AK47s and junior chemistry sets" were trained militia - like literally trained in Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Syria, and pre-invasion Iraq by actual military. Iraq had stockpiled caches of arms and explosives for a resistance going back to the Iran-Iraq War. They were able to get support because they were rallying against a foreign invader, which will almost always unite otherwise opposed factions. They were being bankrolled by other nations and regional powers. The local authorities in Iraq were largely underpaid, unmotivated, seen as traitors supporting the foreign invaders, and at constant risk for their lives. We have had occupying forces there for nearly 18 years, a war which is domestically unpopular and expensive and suffered several costly mistakes in the use of private military contractors.

And yet the idea that they "kicked us right the fuck out of Iraq" is for wrong. IS has been losing territory and control steadily in Iraq for years. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-27838034

But sure, imagine that being able to buy an AR-15 will protect you from the US Army.
You're right, trained and combat-tested ex-military civilians don't exist in in the United States, they spontaneously disappear soon as they sign their DD form 2656, and the American population is entirely comprised of absolute neophytes who have never trained with or practiced with the 400 million guns they currently own.

Yes, IS is losing territory NOW, but let's not gloss over the fact that we were run out of Iraq with our tail between our legs by a vastly inferior opposition because resistances have the willpower for prolonged hostilities - and such a development would fracture the standing US military as well, as others have pointed out, which would only worsen with time.

I'm not saying there'd be any kind of instant victory from marching on washington or any such nonsense... but a protracted opposition to occupation is definitely a hundred times better than being efficiently rounded up into camps due to absence of arms.
 

GasBandit

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Of all the things that didn't happen, that's definitely one of them.
You can disagree with the interpretation all you want, but the fact of the matter is our technological and tactical superiority melts because that's not what warfare is necessarily about anymore. It's designed to win wars between nations, not within nations, and we've had to learn that over and over in Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam, Vietnam, and Korea. We're 1 for 5 since WWII (that one being Gulf War 1, which was between the nations of Iraq and Kuwait and had no prolonged occupation afterwards).

Plus, let me tell you... our military right now? Is in fucking shambles. I've got a cousin serving in the Navy. His ship TAKES ON WATER every time it fires a weapon. Rather than fix it, they decided to do a largely cosmetic deck replacement. Still have to have a bucket brigade with every test firing.
 
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the senate could end this today without trump's approval of the republicans had a spine.
I mean, we'd still have to slog and wait through "due process," but since it's about as likely to happen as getting nationwide fiber Internet or universal healthcare...yeah I won't hold my breath.

--Patrick
 
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Can't pay your rent because of the shutdown? The US government suggests doing chores for your landlord.
I think the exact phrasing they use is "exchange services" with their landlords.
There's also the ones suggesting that people having trouble making rent hold garage/bake sales, or become mystery shoppers.
Yes, that's right. Go get yourself another job so that when the government finally starts back up again, you can just...refuse? Won't that cause other problems?

--Patrick
 
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I didn't say "a" democracy. You're right, we don't have "a" democracy, we have a representative republic, the representatives of which are elected through a process also known as "democracy."

Unless you were asserting we don't have that, either, anymore.

In which case my reply is, "then it's a good thing we have private gun ownership."
We don’t have that anymore. But I look forward to the far armchair gun toting revolution. Oh, wait, they support this government because they honk they are on their side.
 
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There's also the ones suggesting that people having trouble making rent hold garage/bake sales, become mystery shoppers, or instead offer to "exchange services" with their landlords.

--Patrick
I saw our hometown shitbag Glenn Grothman voted to deny pay to the government workers put out of work due to his incompetence.
 
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I feel like Trump has been watching Netflix because the whole "steal money from FEMA by declaring a state of emergency for my pet project," thing is right out of House of Cards
 
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Wow just wow.

Long ago and far away in 2017 before the Mueller investigation began, the FBI was already investigating the President to determine if he was in fact a Russian agent....

This investigation later got rolled into the Special Counsel investigation.

Wow.

Tick tick cheeto, tick tock.
 
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Just found out someone made a gofundme page for building the wall. It didn't make its 1 billion dollar goal, but the fact it did make 20 million in a month makes me so damn disappointed in people. People go on that site looking to cover ten thousand dollar medical bills that no one helps them with, but sure let's throw millions at a false wall that won't do a damn thing.
 

figmentPez

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Trump finally got a real, honest to God record as President. The longest government shutdown in history.
 
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