[News] Several killed in Connecticut Elementary School Shooting

Something has to be done to discourage these mass shooters. Make it illegal to release their names in the media. Bury their worthless carcasses in unmarked graves. Do anything it takes to prevent them from getting any sort of recognition.

And for God's sake, pay the fuck attention to the people in your life. There are always some warning signs.

It's time to extend the background check on gun purchases. Shut down those legal loopholes that allow quick and easy access, like gun shows or online sales. Make any person looking to buy a gun take a fucking course, so the instructors can look for warning signs.

We're fucking this up again and again and again. Now we have a room full of dead toddlers. Fuck the NRA. Fuck the bullshit argument that the founding fathers set up the Second Ammendment to include and all firearms. Fuck the people saying arm teachers. I don't want to carry. I don't want to live in constant fear of an accidental discharge.

This isn't reactionary. We've been here time and again. Pass some God DAMN laws. Make the assault weapons ban permanent. Cut down the number of bullets cartridges can hold. If some fucker skirts the law and somebody gets killed by a gun they sold, they should be charged as an accomplice to murder. It's murder if you participate in a crime where a person is killed even if you didn't do it personally. Why should this be any different?

If politicians had the balls to do any of this, despite the NRA's bitching about any sort of gun control, I'd vote for them. That person would be worth something as a human being.

That post exemplifies why you can't have a gun control debate immediately after a shooting. Emotion trumps everything, and rationality is impossible.

Krisken said:

Lets be honest, no time is the right time for gun control talks. There will always be reasons to not talk seriously about the subject.

Click to expand...

The history of this very forum indicates otherwise very strongly. "Day of" is perhaps a skosh quick.

Not gonna do it. You guys want to talk to me about that, I'll see you monday.

Krisken said:

I disagree. This forum has no power to affect any real change. What we debate (and I use that term very loosely) on a daily basis doesn't have any power.

Click to expand...

... but that's the scope of the discussion. I'm not talking about the rest of the world, I'm talking about how zappit is completely incapable of reason right now. He will brook nothing other than complete submission to his frothing, righteous rage.

And "It's too quick" is just as much an appeal to emotion as "Think about the children". Only difference is the point it is supporting.

Click to expand...

No, "it's too soon" is not to spare anyone's feelings, it is because it is impossible to have a civil, rational discussion about this while the bodies are still being cleaned up.

As for talking to you about it? Nah.

Click to expand...

You always do. And then you stop, and then you come back. You're my own personal little forum battered wife.

Krisken said:

Gabby Giffords, the mosque in Milwaukee, etc. It's not like this shit isn't happening a lot. The reason people naturally turn to the gun control debate when there is gun violence is because it is fresh on their minds.

Click to expand...

And eventually, after both that AND aurora, we did have discussions about gun control, remember?[DOUBLEPOST=1355529383][/DOUBLEPOST]

Krisken said:

Nah, not anymore. You've made it obvious you don't want to play nice.

Click to expand...

"I'll believe it when I believe it." - Yogi Berra

GasBandit said:

That post exemplifies why you can't have a gun control debate immediately after a shooting. Emotion trumps everything, and rationality is impossible.

Click to expand...

So many are willingly blind to the horrors of these mass murders, claiming there's too much emotion involved. It's been months since Aurora. Over a year since Virginia Tech. It's been years since Columbine. Think time has changed my mind that the suggestions I made seem so necessary? I've believed this for years and years. Every time this happens it just gets worse and worse. Is a roomful of dead kindergartners not enough to get those "Don't be so hasty." folks to wake up to the reality of the world, that these things are happening and we're not doing enough - hell, we're not doing ANYTHING - to prevent these massacres? There are people practically putting out their eyes to remain blind.

This needs to be the absolute last straw. These kids were babies, innocent babies, gunned down by yet another nut who got his hands on firearms.

Time to open your eyes.

I'm frothing? Frothing? I've worked with students at every grade level. I've gone through training for what happened in Connecticut. I've seen those same young innocent faces, the same kind if faces ripped from this world today.

No, I'm not frothing, Gas. I'm sick of it. Sick this can not only happen, but keeps happening, and always wary it will happen in my school.

And I'm sick of people like you, people who make it so much harder to safeguard these innocent lives. Who seek to put off the conversation on this topic indefinitely, while more massacres take place.

Frothing? Incapable of reason? Fuck you, Gas, you self-righteous prick.

And my case is made, ladies and gentlemen. Have a good weekend, see you monday.

GasBandit said:

And my case is made, ladies and gentlemen. Have a good weekend, see you monday.

Click to expand...

No real retort? No rebuff of my perfectly reasonable ideas that won't infringe on Second Ammendment rights? Did you just prove my point about people who would rather never have the debate?

Or is it just getting too hard to be so smug when we're talking about twenty dead five year olds?

Gilg is right about a total ban on guns being a catastrophic failure. But there are things that can be done reduce the damage guns are capable of:

-Reduce the number of bullets a magazine an hold. Make this a standard in manufacturing. A mass shooter can't fire off as many shots, and having to change magazines at least gives people a chance to get away or tackle the bastard.

-Prevent sales to those with documented mental health issues such as schizophrenia. That's not discriminatory. People suffering from such conditions can pose a risk to themselves and others if they are not being helped, more so than people who do not have such conditions.

-Add a day or two to the waiting period to buy a gun and require more thorough background checks. Close legal loopholes that allow gun shows and online sales to skirt existing waiting period laws.

-Hold unscrupulous sellers responsible for putting deadly weapons in the hands of dangerous people. I know you can't see the future, but I'm talking about people who would seek to circumvent the law to sell. If a person can be convicted for murder if an accomplice kills a victim during a crime, then why should a gun seller who ignored laws and sold a murder weapon to a killer get off scot-free? Make criminal sellers responsible for the crimes their weapons are used in, lock them up, and you've created a deterrent, or at least shut down the ones who do it often.

-Make the assault weapon ban permanent. It makes no sense for a civilian to have a weapon capable of spitting out so many bullets in such a short time. You have every right to defend yourself, but you don't need a machine gun to do it.

-is it so wrong to encourage prospective gun owners to take a course on responsible ownership? We don't let people just start driving without teaching them first, and cars can be mighty dangerous in up untrained hands, too.

Adding more guns to the equation will only compound the problem. That's more to lose, to get stolen, to wind up in the wrong hands. Others have argued that if the teachers and administrators were armed themselves, they could have put that animal down before he did so much damage. Really? How will people react after the first accidental discharge in a classroom? - God forbid it doesn't hit anybody. A teacher's first priority is protecting his/her students and getting them away from danger, not getting into a firefight with a madman. Plus, this man targeted a specific person - his mother - and then turned on the children. What mother would expect that? How can a dead teacher, armed or not, shoot and kill a gunman? Wouldn't preventing this guy from getting the guns do more?

Quotemander Prime said:

I got off the forum after my last post, and told my wife how I was impressed that this thread hadn't devolved into stupid shit like it usually does when tragedies happen.

Boy did I speak too fucking soon.

Click to expand...

I'm sorry for the part I played in that, but this one one stung me really, really deeply.

Sparhawk said:

Fully automatic firearms (machine guns) have been illegal in the states since the 1930's. What is an assault weapon?

Click to expand...

I meant assault rifles. The ban on them expired a while back, and there hasn't been a serious discussion on renewing it.