Former President Trump Thread

PatrThom

PatrThom

Trump is in town today.
There are lines three MILES long outside the venue of people waiting to get in.
This is not hyperbole. One of my coworkers texted a pic of people queued up all the way to her apartment building which is located almost-but-not-quite three miles away from the venue.
So technically I guess it’s not really a 3mi line, it’s only actually something like 2.8mi.
That’s an impressive level of dedication.

Word is that the giant orange baby balloon was also slated to make an appearance, but I haven’t found any coverage as to whether they were able to successfully fly it.

—Patrick
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

Trump announced they won't touch Obamacare until after the 2020 election. Because even his simpleton supporters will get mad if they actually lose their healthcare, but they are too dumb to realize that's what he wants to do.
 
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Dave

Dave

Staff member
blotsfan said:
Trump announced they won't touch Obamacare after the 2020 election. Because even his simpleton supporters will get mad if they actually lose their healthcare, but they are too dumb to realize that's what he wants to do.
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No, that's not what he's doing at all. This is so blatantly transparent it's asinine.

Here's what Trump does.

  1. Creates a crisis out of thin air. In this case it's the revocation of Obamacare and the removal of pre-existing conditions.
  2. The internet and the left buy into it and create a stink about it.
  3. The right rises up to back Trump and further the divide.
  4. Trump then reverses himself or "fixes" the problem that he creates.
  5. LOL the crazy left and LOL the right keeps winning.
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

I left out a key word in my initial post. Edited.

That being said, trump (and the republican party in general) constantly has tried to remove Obamacare. He was one McCain vote away from doing so.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
I'm annoyed at the whole close the border thing because it's another manufactured crisis (see my previous post), but it really does shine a light on the hypocrisy of both sides.

Example:

The right always gives the left shit about guns. "If we ban guns only the bad guys and police state will have guns!" or "There's no way you can ban all guns."

So now the right wants to close the border because reasons. The left is saying then that the only people now coming in are illegals or "when no good people are let in only the bad people are left".

Neither side is seeing the stupidity and just ratcheting up the rhetoric.
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

First of all, that's not why closing the border is a dumb idea.

Secondly, the ideas aren't that comparable anyways. The idea of "only bad people would own guns" implies that people are in a strict binary of good and evil and nobody who owns a gun that hasn't yet murdered someone will ever murder someone. Meanwhile, shutting down the places where the people you're trying to keep out aren't going accomplishes...?
 
Dei

Dei

Man, can you imagine Mexico banning US travelers as a response? All of those stupid college kids on Spring Break are going to be sad.
 
Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

blotsfan said:
tHe TrUtH iS In tHe mIDdLe
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Centrists are the reason we're in the mess we're in now. Sure, the gop might be demonstrably evil and counter to just about anything citizens would want, but the left makes dumb arguments too, so let's just low key support the terrible status quo.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
blotsfan said:
Also, conflating illegal immigrants with "bad people" is pretty shitty
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And there's the whole "change thing around to be offended so I can invalidate your point". It's like paint by numbers or predicting a movie you've seen a thousand times. Yet you don't get the irony of what you are doing. At all.
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

Dave said:
And there's the whole "change thing around to be offended so I can invalidate your point". It's like paint by numbers or predicting a movie you've seen a thousand times. Yet you don't get the irony of what you are doing. At all.
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I can invalidate your point because it's dumb. I actually did. You just said "And there's the proof of my statement." The eternal cry of the enlightened centrist. You either can't or won't put an ounce of thought into what I said other than to dismiss it as proof that you're above both sides.
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

Let me try dumbing it down for you since you're being dense as fuck:

"If you ban guns, only bad people will own guns" is flawed because sometimes "good people" turn into "bad people."

"Closing the border won't stop illegal immigration" makes sense since the parts of the border that will be effected aren't the same parts that people illegally crossing go through.
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

I'm not sure you even read what you wrote if you're not getting what I'm saying.

Whatever. Just another trash centrist. Not sure why I'd expect anything better.
 
AshburnerX

AshburnerX

Dei said:
Man, can you imagine Mexico banning US travelers as a response? All of those stupid college kids on Spring Break are going to be sad.
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It's more like "Well fuck all those Mexican-Americans who might want to see a relative south of the border, AM I RIGHT?".

Honestly though, most "illegals" are just people who got a visa and overstayed it or got one with no intention of returning. You only need to do the whole "life and death race across the border" thing if can't get one for whatever reason or have to get around Mexico's southern border.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
See, here's the thing that I find funny about the whole @blotsfan amazingly condescending screed. (I, by the way, was in a meeting for most of this so I couldn't post.)

The point I was trying to make is the nonsensical arguments and false equivocations that are given by both the left and the right, yet at the same time and without irony they compare and contrast utter bullshit in the name of making their points. Like closing the border to stop immigration, which is a stupid idea for a multitude of reasons. Just like banning all guns is stupid for a multitude of reasons. The SAME logical fallacies are made in each case - if we do X then only Y people will...It's the same argument and both are ludicrous.

And as soon as I do that then Blots comes in and essentially makes every left talking point like we'd planned it beforehand. And yet he doesn't see the irony or hypocrisy of it. He's so hyper-focused and tunnel visioned that he ignores the bad things his side does while vilifying - CORRECTLY - the same stupid arguments of the other side. And then goes on to discount everything I say with a strawman - "enlightened centrist", "trash centrist" - what a fucking joke.

But let me dumb it down for you. You can be as condescending as you like. You can be insulting. You can think you have the moral high ground to justify how well you sleep at night. But in the end, regardless of the evil the right does and the bullshit they peddle, you are no better and are part of the problem as well.

And yes, I have done the same thing. While I'm singling you out in this post, I'm by no means saying I've been above the fray. I've said stupid shit. I'll probably say stupid shit in the future. I'm part of the problem as well. As is Gas, as is Poe, as is...
 
DarkAudit

DarkAudit

Dei said:
Man, can you imagine Mexico banning US travelers as a response? All of those stupid college kids on Spring Break are going to be sad.
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Part of me wants to be an asshole and if the border is closed, then the spring breakers *can't go home*. And the Mexican officials shrug and blame cheeto.
 
PatrThom

PatrThom

blotsfan said:
Also, conflating illegal immigrants with "bad people" is pretty shitty
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It’s all about the branding.
Dave said:
You can be as condescending as you like. You can be insulting. You can think you have the moral high ground to justify how well you sleep at night. But in the end, regardless of the evil the right does and the bullshit they peddle, you are no better and are part of the problem as well.
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Well, what did you expect? He’s a Sports Fan, a person conditioned to throw blind loyalty behind a particular group or its accomplishments, and predisposed to ignore arguments to the contrary. Of course he’s not going to listen to you, no matter how well-reasoned your argument(s) might be.

/s, duh - deliberate conflation in that second part

—Patrick
 
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Dave

Dave

Staff member
But branding gun owners as bad are perfectly fine. Like all illegals are angels and all gun owners are redneck white supremacists who love jesus and hate brown people.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
blotsfan said:
"If you ban guns, only bad people will own guns" is flawed because sometimes "good people" turn into "bad people."
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Yet you give a pass to illegals who are ALREADY breaking the law and yes, some are criminals other than just trying to make a better life for themselves. Because sometimes illegals are "bad people".

What you lack most times is the ability to see things from both sides. You circle the wagons and turn myopic. The right is very, very short sighted in a lot of cases, but the left is just as dumb in other areas. If you can't admit that and see your own faults, it's impossible to work on them to get better.
 
PatrThom

PatrThom

blotsfan said:
Please point out where I said all gun owners are bad.
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I’d like to point out that the maxim is “If guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have guns.” It does not talk about “good people” or “bad people.” It does not brand these outlaws as either good or bad, it merely brands them as outlaws, i.e., people who deliberately chose to ignore the law. Whether that makes them “good” or “bad” is a different, philosophical discussion.

—Patrick
 
blotsfan

blotsfan

Dave said:
Yet you give a pass to illegals who are ALREADY breaking the law and yes, some are criminals other than just trying to make a better life for themselves. Because sometimes illegals are "bad people".
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My point wasn't that all illegal immigrants are good people. My point was that if they aren't crossing the border at a legal point of entry, how is shutting down the legal point of entry going to make a difference for them?
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
Right. I get that. And if the Trump administration was talking about closing the border to help with drug trafficking it would make sense, seeing as most of the illegal drugs coming in are from legal points of entry.

But see, this is exactly the same as the "banning all guns" argument. Banning all guns would mean that people who are good gun owners would no longer have guns, whereas bad guys would still get their guns illegally through things like theft, smuggling, etc. It's the SAME ARGUMENT.

When legal points of sale/ingress are blocked, only those doing illegal things will be unaffected.

Same argument. And that's MY point. It's what I've said since the first post in this exchange.
 
Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

Dave said:
Right. I get that. And if the Trump administration was talking about closing the border to help with drug trafficking it would make sense, seeing as most of the illegal drugs coming in are from legal points of entry.

But see, this is exactly the same as the "banning all guns" argument. Banning all guns would mean that people who are good gun owners would no longer have guns, whereas bad guys would still get their guns illegally through things like theft, smuggling, etc. It's the SAME ARGUMENT.

When legal points of sale/ingress are blocked, only those doing illegal things will be unaffected.

Same argument. And that's MY point. It's what I've said since the first post in this exchange.
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The biggest difference I can see is I don't know of anyone actually calling for the banning of all guns.
 
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