PS4 is revealed
- Thread starter Frank
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Fuck you, Sony.
I suppose at some point we all have to realize that the target market for both the PS and the Xbox is less about people who care about the longevity of games, and more about the dude-bros who are only concerned with being able to play the most dude-brotasticaly awesome new CoD game and the most dude-brotasticaly awesome new sports franchise game with the rest of their dude-bros.
"We want nothing to get between you and the game. Here's a bunch of stuff that gets between you and the game."
And it's Sony doublespeak like that which makes me disbelieve the exec that says Sony will not have a block on used games for the PS4. No one at that company has any solid idea about what's going on.
They learned nothing from the PS3's shitty release, did they?
fade
Staff member
You know what I really want? A nice console. One that plays good games. I couldn't give two poops about PC gaming. I sit at a computer all day, so you know what I really want to do nights and weekends? Stare at a computer. At least with a console, I can sit back on my couch.
You know what sells this PS4 to me? The suspend feature. That says "dad gamer" all over it. Seriously, that is the killer in all of that doody.
You know what sells this PS4 to me? The suspend feature. That says "dad gamer" all over it. Seriously, that is the killer in all of that doody.
I'm really amazed that they didn't push the "streams" to your Vita/PSP thing as more a "now Dad/Mom you can keep playing your games & still keep your kids company while they watch Dora" angle instead of the "ALWAY KEEP GAMING!!" thing. The WiiU sort of pushed this, but only at E3.
This actually a real thing experienced by people who actually have money to buy extraneous entertainment goods. I mentioned this to my friend who just had a kid, and he was like, "Huh. That could actually be useful".
This actually a real thing experienced by people who actually have money to buy extraneous entertainment goods. I mentioned this to my friend who just had a kid, and he was like, "Huh. That could actually be useful".
You realize you can connect your PC to a TV right? It's still the ultimate -console-
My kids have all 3 consoles and a gaming PC connected to their TV in the living room, they use the PC way more than the consoles and they still get to sit on the couch and use a controller.
Hey guys, a photo of the PS4 console was leaked:
My PC is hooked up to my TV with an Xbox controller. I'm pretty much set for most games. The only time I get a console game is when it's an exclusive that I really want. Ni No Kuni, Uncharted, Infamous, etc...
I don't understand why, if I log into the PSN on the PS4, I can't download the stuff I own on there.
Unless they're scrapping PSN entirely for something new. Which would be really stupid since the Vita uses it.
But then, this is Sony.
Unless they're scrapping PSN entirely for something new. Which would be really stupid since the Vita uses it.
But then, this is Sony.
Hey guys, a photo of the PS4 console was leaked:
Sony Entertainment
Official Memo
From: Office of the Chairman
To: Research and Development
Find the guy who thought this was what I meant by "quad core" and have him executed.
My guess is that they don't want to include the PS3 hardware (because it would make it more expensive) and they aren't sure how to emulate it yet. Ether those or they just want to force you to rebuy stuff on the PSN.
I suspect they'll be pulling an Nintendo and offering stuff you've already payed for at a vastly reduced price.
I suspect they'll be pulling an Nintendo and offering stuff you've already payed for at a vastly reduced price.
Exactly. I can't fathom a reason to choose a console over a PC other than price and exclusives.
Though I think spending $600 on a console instead of upgrading your PC, isn't your best bang for buck for gaming.
I can see price being a factor. to really remain on top of the graphics curve, I do have to buy a whole new system every 7-10 years when my processor or memory start bottlenecking performance, with graphics cards running 200.00 or so depending on how far behind you're willing to go every 3-4 years. In the long run it's more expensive, but paying 15-30 per game if you're patient with steam sales, it may actually be a better bang for your buck. Especially because games tend to look so much better on PC.
For the same reason that you needed to download Rosetta to run pre-Intel (non-universal) mac programs on Intel Macs.
It's a different chip architecture, and for that to work you either need to include the old chip tech (like the PS2 did to support PS1 titles), emulate it (like the original PS3 did for select PS2 titles), or re-build the program for the new environment (like PSN eventually did for lots of things).
They've already said they're going to be using Gaikai to stream their PSN library (which is why how that's priced is going to be important), so maybe that's how they're planning to do an end-run around that problem.
In an ideal world (which we probably won't get), we will have the options to stream any PSN game we've purchased regardless of whether it's been re-built or not to a PS4, but games where the dev has actually bothered to re-build it will be downloadable to play.
fade
Staff member
Yeah, I know you can do that, but that requires futzing around with the PC, and going through the OS, instead of just flopping back and popping in a game that is guaranteed to work with no other input from me. I know how to make a PC sit up and bark like a dog, but I just don't want to when I have 20 minutes to play a game.
(Also, I paid 225 for a new PS3 from Target several years ago now, not 600)
Uh no?
Plug in an HDMI cable (like you did your console), turn on the PC (like turning on the console), select your game (like navigating your console menu), start playing (no different than your console).
I don't think you know how to make it sit up and bark like a dog. Sounds to me like you make it needlessly complicated.
You could use Steam big screen mode, it's a total of one click.
fade
Staff member
oookay. better go quit my job then. I'm not speaking from ignorance. Last time I hooked a PC up to my TV, it didn't go anything like that. But whatever. Maybe the experience has improved since last time I tried. It really doesn't matter, because I'm not not going to buy a PC to attach to my TV for lots of other reasons, like cost, and the fact that that computer becomes unusable when people are watching TV, unless I go through the effort to make it so. In any case you're welcome to use yours and I'll still enjoy the way I do things.
You're right. It's changed. You're also welcome to enjoy things they way they are.
As for cost, I already addressed as did Bowielee that the cost can easily be offset or even cheaper to use a gaming PC as a console.
As for unusable when people are watching TV, I dunno what to tell you, we have TVs in the bedrooms for when someone wants to watch something while one TV is being used.
I'm just simply explaining how easy it is to use a gaming PC as a better console for those who thought it might be difficult. Your response was contrary to that point, so I had to address it as incorrect.
fade
Staff member
Eh, I don't think it's incorrect. I mean, I'm not talking about ages or generations ago. I'm talking about the last time I hooked up an HDMI projector to a Windows 7 laptop. Yeah, I know that's not quite the same because it's a temporary connection.
But whatever, I don't really have a dog in this fight. I'm simply not buying a new pricey PC when I can wait for a console a year into its life and expect it to flawlessly run the games I buy for it, both from the past library and years to come--with no thought about it whatsoever. That's really what I was talking about anyway, more than the physical connection to the TV or the controller. In a year, a new PC game may not run optimally on the gaming PC, and while upgrading the PC may be easy, I just don't want to have to deal with it.
But whatever, I don't really have a dog in this fight. I'm simply not buying a new pricey PC when I can wait for a console a year into its life and expect it to flawlessly run the games I buy for it, both from the past library and years to come--with no thought about it whatsoever. That's really what I was talking about anyway, more than the physical connection to the TV or the controller. In a year, a new PC game may not run optimally on the gaming PC, and while upgrading the PC may be easy, I just don't want to have to deal with it.
I'm of a mind that, like the PS3, this is something I see no point in getting for the first three years it's out. Sony can work out their problems on someone else's dollar.
Answered yourself there. An HD TV through an HDMI cable on a PC is identical to hooking up a console. It's not difficult.
This should have been where your post ended, because everything that follows is pretty much poking the very dog you say isn't fighting.
A PC will run the past library flawlessly, as for running the future games for years to come, there have been plenty of issues with consoles running games with serious lag issues and frame rate problems. There's nothing you can do to allievate that problem on a console, with a PC, you simply upgrade some ram (as cheap as a game) or buy a video card (1-2 generations past the current will run anything fine and won't be expensive either) and your framerate and graphics problems will not persist. So I don't see how a console will be the answer to running all games flawlessly.
The thing you're really talking about is not wanting to deal with it. (That's totally fine, it's a point I wouldn't have even looked at twice because that's opinion and not a fact that can be debated) It has nothing to do with a PC being more difficult or not as user friendly as a console. Upgrading ram or a video card (takes about 10 minutes to change on a PC), which is going to be the majority of the problem you'll ever have during a console's lifecycle is not difficult, and will always run games more flawlessly than a console trying to keep up with games being made on a much higher tech than they can produce, then having to downgrade the quality and fluidity when it is converted to console.
Again I 100% respect the fact that maybe you just don't want to install hardware every 4-5yrs into a gaming PCs lifecycle, but don't try and cover it up by saying it's hard or that a console will always run games better, because neither of those are true at all.
Jesus. This is why tablet gaming is becoming so popular. It doesn't matter what version of ios device you buy, if you buy an ios device all the games you get will transfer up to your next one. If you buy a game on an android device, it will transfer up to every android device you buy. I get that they're going to a new hardware platform, but they can take the time to build an emulator to allow old game purchases to port over to the new one if they really want. They're not some back woods garage company. It's fucking Sony.
fade
Staff member
Again, not the experience I've had. I never said "difficult". Futzing about != difficult, just annoying.
I... don't agree with this at all! I can not really care about an argument and still defend what I said. Why shouldn't I?Gilgamesh said:
I never once said that consoles run games better. That's silly. I said I don't have to think about it and I can flop back on my couch in pretty much every post I made. I never said anything was "hard" either. Nope. Just read all 3 posts. Never said either of those things. In fact, I said it was easy right there in that last post! I'm well aware of how much effort it takes to upgrade RAM and video cards. I used to run a side business building PCs as far back as 1994. I said I just didn't want to deal with it--which was the entire point of a console ("dealing" meaning physical/financial/whatever effort)! I said that from the very first post! Jeez, I didn't cover anything up.Gilgamesh said:
-shrug- My point was that PC gaming is just as cheap (in the long run), just as easy, and in many cases superior to console gaming. Your response is that you want to -flop back on the couch- and not -hassle with all that- whatever either of those statements mean. I suppose there's nothing left to discuss then.
That was the case several posts ago.
Yep, guess I was wrong.
fade
Staff member
I wasn't really interested in a PC vs. console war anyway. I started off describing my personal preference. I believe I was a bit less vague, but allow me to place specifics on it. I've spent less than $450 on my PS3 over 4 years--probably much less if I count sellbacks and the console I sold to buy it. I've never once had an issue running a console game for the console it was branded for on any console I've ever owned, and I'll keep the PS3 another few years. A PC is great gaming machine--but not for me. I was never arguing about gaming superiority, but about use cases. I'm not a heavy gamer. I want to invest less than zero mental, physical, or financial effort on the console (regardless of how hard or easy it is), because it has roughly zero bearing on the rest of my life.
It's literally more of a pain in the ass to play my PS3 than my PC games. I start from the same place (my couch) and to play a PS3 game, I have to go to the shelf and get a disk, put it in the system. With my PC, I sit on my couch, click on steam and launch whatever game I feel like playing.[DOUBLEPOST=1361513744][/DOUBLEPOST]Really, if Valve came out with a console that allowed you to use standard graphics cards, I would never use any other system.
If that's how we look at it I spent less than $500 after sellbacks on my previous gaming system for the newer one. I've upgraded parts maybe once a year at what I would have spent on new games (and instead bought games for next to nothing off STEAM/GoG/GamersGate). I've purchased a game on the PS3/Xbox that just has non-stop fps issues in heavy gameplay and sold it for a copy of the PC version (for cheaper) and it played much much better (Dead Space is an example if one is required). As for use cases? A PC is always going to indefinitely have more uses over a console.
As for investing less than zero mental/physical effort? That's a perfectly understandable opinion, though I fail to personally see how 10-15 minutes to change out some hardware every 4-5 years is so tedious. As for financial? Maybe I'm just more cash savvy. Not sure how else to respond to it.
Nice touch with the -zero bearing on the rest of your life- line though.
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