Fuck off China...

[Chazwozel]

http://www1.voanews.com/english/new...ncel-Planned-Dalai-Lama-Meeting-84212077.html

China is urging the US government to cancel plans for President Barack Obama to meet next week with Tibet's exiled spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Ma Zhaoxu issued a statement Friday, urging the United States to, in his words, \"immediately withdraw\" plans for a meeting between President Obama and the Dalai Lama.

Ma indicated that the meeting could further hurt Sino-American relations, which are already strained because of a U.S. arms sale to Taiwan, disagreements over China's currency exchange rate and U.S. concerns over Chinese internet censorship.

Zhu Weiqun, the vice-minister of the Chinese Communist Party's United Front Work Department, which handles Tibet issues, recently made the same point.

Zhu says if the U.S. leader chooses to meet with the Dalai Lama, it will threaten trust and cooperation between China and the United States.

The White House Thursday confirmed that President Obama will meet the Dalai Lama on February 18, despite China's objections. White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said Mr. Obama will meet with the Tibetan spiritual leader, a fellow Nobel laureate, as an internationally respected religious figure.

The United States recognizes Tibet as a part of China, but has urged Beijing and the Dalai Lama to talk together to address differences over the region's future.

China took over Tibet in 1950. The Dalai Lama fled to exile in India in 1959, after a failed uprising against Chinese rule in his homeland. China considers the Dalai Lama a separatist and has tried to isolate him by urging foreign leaders not to meet with him.

The Dalai Lama repeatedly has said he is not seeking independence for Tibet, but instead wants what he describes as a high level of genuine autonomy for his homeland.

China has sent hundreds of millions of dollars in development aid to Tibet, in an effort to ensure stability by actively raising living standards there. Tibetan exiles accuse the Chinese government of discriminating against and repressing their culture and religion.

I love how China thinks it's got the US completely by the balls due to economics when the truth is that China needs the US just as much as the US needs China.

 

[Dave]

They kinda do, especially when they realize that we have no pull over them at all. We can rage impotently about their Human rights, but there's nothing we can do more than rattling our sabers.

 

[@Li3n]

while the loss of the american market would affect them a lot they could probably affect the US a lot more, so they are in a better position... but i doubt that they'd sacrifice their current prosperity just to get you.

 

[Chazwozel]

while the loss of the american market would affect them a lot they could probably affect the US a lot more, so they are in a better position... but i doubt that they'd sacrifice their current prosperity just to get you.

If anything, severed ties with China, would force US companies to repool their outsourced work and industry back home. Who's China's biggest buyer? The U.S. We're both in the same boat, but the U.S. has been under a prosperous self-dependent economy before. We can do it again. China, not so much. Their government seems to think the rest of the world operates the same way their people do towards the Chinese government. You can't tell a world leader not to visit with another one with vague threats of backlash and strained relations when your economy completely depends on that leader's country.

 

[Rob King]

Didn't Obama turn down a meeting with the Dali Lama last year? I was afraid the was bending over for the Chinese then, but this development makes me wonder if it was something much less sinister.

 

[GasBandit]

We do kinda owe them a trillion dollars. While it's true they need us to be able to buy their toxic lead baby toys as much as we need them to float us the loans to buy votes, there gets to be a point where the guy you owe 10% of your GDP starts thinking he can tell you what to do.

 

[Chazwozel]

We do kinda owe them a trillion dollars. While it's true they need us to be able to buy their toxic lead baby toys as much as we need them to float us the loans to buy votes, there gets to be a point where the guy you owe 10% of your GDP starts thinking he can tell you what to do.

Wait those national debts actually mean something? In that case, I think the US needs to start collecting too. I've often wondered about economics in general. Econ is a completely man made thing right. The current market is all just arbitrary numbers set to price out how much pieces of paper and electronic digits are worth. Can't we all just get together and reset the system?

 

[@Li3n]

We're both in the same boat, but the U.S. has been under a prosperous self-dependent economy before.

When was this?! As i recall you where more like in Chaina's shoes once with Europe being, well, you guys.

 

[sixpackshaker]

It does not feel so good to be the colony now and not the imperialist.

 

[Baerdog]

We're both in the same boat, but the U.S. has been under a prosperous self-dependent economy before.

When was this?! As i recall you where more like in Chaina's shoes once with Europe being, well, you guys.[/QUOTE]
America in the late 19th and early 20th centuries was very isolationist and didn't participate in world trade to the huge extent we do today. It was also when we were shifting from an agricultural to a more industrialized economy. The biggest thing we were "importing" at the time was labor, from the millions of immigrants coming over from Europe and Asia.

 

[@Li3n]

And China was once the most culturally advanced country in the world... neither counts towards the current power either country has.

 

[GasBandit]

We do kinda owe them a trillion dollars. While it's true they need us to be able to buy their toxic lead baby toys as much as we need them to float us the loans to buy votes, there gets to be a point where the guy you owe 10% of your GDP starts thinking he can tell you what to do.

Wait those national debts actually mean something? In that case, I think the US needs to start collecting too. I've often wondered about economics in general. Econ is a completely man made thing right. The current market is all just arbitrary numbers set to price out how much pieces of paper and electronic digits are worth. Can't we all just get together and reset the system?[/QUOTE]

I've often said that the world is fueled by bullshit. Often, even business relationships are held together by a mutual unspoken agreement not to call each other on bullshit. As a personal example, here at the radio station we often purchase services that really have no ostensible market value (show prep, sound effects) and pay for them by running commercial advertising (and advertising itself as an industry is entirely based on bullshit), and we submit them a list of times that we SWEAR UP AND DOWN is an accurate representation of how many and which of their commercials aired and when... which is, not infrequently, bullshit. And every side involved knows all of this bullshit is what it is... they just don't say anything because it's how we all have jobs and get paid.

The problem starts when one side starts building up a lot more bullshit than the other... to the point where the other then feels they have to call the one's bullshit. Then the whole damn thing falls apart and nobody comes out ahead and lives are ruined and the earth is salted.

We've been building a whole lot of bullshit of late.

---------- Post added at 02:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:58 PM ----------

And China was once the most culturally advanced country in the world... neither counts towards the current power either country has.

Hey, you asked when, the man told you when. And the when was less than 100 years ago, so...

 

[Fun Size]

We do kinda owe them a trillion dollars. While it's true they need us to be able to buy their toxic lead baby toys as much as we need them to float us the loans to buy votes, there gets to be a point where the guy you owe 10% of your GDP starts thinking he can tell you what to do.

Wait those national debts actually mean something? In that case, I think the US needs to start collecting too. I've often wondered about economics in general. Econ is a completely man made thing right. The current market is all just arbitrary numbers set to price out how much pieces of paper and electronic digits are worth. Can't we all just get together and reset the system?[/QUOTE]

Yes, but the button is really hard to find and you need a paperclip or something to get to it.

 

[Covar]

I've got a paper clip!

Gentlemen, GasBandit, FIND THAT BUTTON!!!!

 

[@Li3n]

[/COLOR]

And China was once the most culturally advanced country in the world... neither counts towards the current power either country has.

Hey, you asked when, the man told you when. And the when was less than 100 years ago, so...

So what?! It's no more relevant to the situation then China's state 500 to 700 years ago... heck, a a counterpoint would be that China survived worse.

 

[Terrik]

This isn't anything really new. They do this every time the Dali Lama comes around. They did it to Germany, France, the　ＵＳ，　ｅｔｃ．　Ｉｔ＇ｓ　ｐａｒ　ｆｏｒ　ｔｈｅ　ｐｏｌｉｔｉｃａｌ　ｃｏｕｒｓｅ　ｆｏｒ　Ｃｈｉｎａ．　Ｔｈｅｙ　ｗｅｒｅ　ａｌｓｏ　ｖｅｒｂａｌｌｙ　ｆｌｏｇｇｉｎｇ　ｔｈｅ　ＵＳ　ｆｏｒ　ｔｈｅ　Ｔａｉｗａｎ　ａｒｍｓ　ｓａｌｅｓ　ａｓ　ｗｅｌｌ．　Ｓｉｎｃｅ　Ｉ＇ｍ　ｉｎ　Ｃｈｉｎａ，　Ｉ　ｇｅｔ　ｔｏ　ｗａｔｃｈ　ｔｈｅ　ＣＣＴＶ　ｎｅｗｓ，　ａｎｄ　ｔｈｅｙ　ｗｅｒｅ　Ａｍｅｒｉｃａ　ｂａｓｈｉｎｇ　ｆｏｒ　ｓｏｍｅ　ｔｉｍｅ，　ｂｕｔ　ｉｔ　ｈａｓ　ｓｉｎｃｅ　ｄｉｅｄ　ｏｆｆ．　　Ｏｎ　ｏｎｅ　ｐａｒｔｉｃｕｌａｒ　ｖｉｄｅｏ　ｓｉｔｅ，　ｔｈｅｒｅ　ｗａｓ　ａ　ｖｉｄｅｏ　ｏｆ　ｔｈｅ　ｆｏｒｅｉｇｎ　ｍｉｎｉｓｔｅｒ　ｇｉｖｉｎｇ　ｈｅｒ　ｕｓｕａｌ　ｓｐｉｅｌ　ｏｆ　＂Ｗｅ　ｓｔｒｏｎｇｌｙ　ｃｏｎｄｅｍ　ｔｈｅ　ＵＳ　ｆｏｒ　ｔｈｅｓｅ　ａｃｔｉｏｎｓ＂　ａｎｄ　ｓｏ　ｏｎ．　　Ｏｎｅ　ｐｏｓｔｅｒ　ｌｅｆｔ　ａ　ｃｏｍｍｅｎｔ　ｍｏｃｋｉｎｇｌｙ　ｓａｙｉｎｇ　（ｉｎ　Ｃｈｉｎｅｓｅ）　＂Ｗｅ　ｓｔｒｏｎｇｌｙ　ｃｏｎｄｅｍ　ｙｏｕｒ　ａｃｔｉｏｎｓ－－－ａｒｅ　ｙｏｕ　ａｆｒａｉｄ　ｙｅｔ？！＂　　Ｅｖｅｎ　ｃｏｍｅ　Ｃｈｉｎｅｓｅ　ｒｏｌｌ　ｔｈｅｉｒ　ｅｙｅｓ　ａｔ　ｔｈｅ　ｃｏｎｓｔａｎ　＂ｃｏｎｄｅｍｎａｔｉｏｎｓ＂　ｔｈａｔ　ｒｏｌｌ　ｏｕｔ　ｏｆ　ｔｈｅ　ｃｅｎｔｒａｌ　ｇｏｖｅｒｎｍｅｎｔ．

 

[AshburnerX]

Holy crap... look at the text in Terrick's post! It looks like the Party edited it for content and forgot to fix the text :biggrin:

 

[Chibibar]

economically China do hold 1 trillion dollar of U.S. debt http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/08/business/worldbusiness/08yuan.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1 Now of course China is in a good position since they produce a lot of good that the world want (cheap labor, production etc etc etc) Now, food production is a bit low in China so kinda depend on each other. My father told me that U.S. do export food (he deals with a lot of business in China and U.S.) so both Countries do depend on each other, but where are we in terms of U.S. for "self dependent"?

U.S. depends on oil (sad but still true) Iran is testing those waters with their nuclear production. (Iran is still #4 in oil output. kinda hard to piss someone when you need their oil or at least other countries still do)
U.S. depends on a lot of goods made in China. We have tons of business (production) I mean look at most of our stuff in our home. They are made in China.

Even Goggle bow down to China (until recently but that is remain to be seen since they haven't pull out yet) If the President continues his plan to see the Dalai Lama, China may refuse to buy anymore U.S. debt and thus U.S. won't have the money they need to do their pet projects. I think that is where the president might balk a little since he really need that money to turn U.S. economy around. (that is my opinion)

 

[AshburnerX]

If the President continues his plan to see the Dalai Lama, China may refuse to buy anymore U.S. debt and thus U.S. won't have the money they need to do their pet projects. I think that is where the president might balk a little since he really need that money to turn U.S. economy around. (that is my opinion)

To which we would respond by imposing harsh tariffs and taxes on the importation of Chinese goods to the US. Without it's largest buyer, China would be in as much trouble as we would. The "People's" Party may not enjoy the fact that the US treats with the Dali Lama, but it knows which side it's bread is buttered on.

 

[Chibibar]

If the President continues his plan to see the Dalai Lama, China may refuse to buy anymore U.S. debt and thus U.S. won't have the money they need to do their pet projects. I think that is where the president might balk a little since he really need that money to turn U.S. economy around. (that is my opinion)

To which we would respond by imposing harsh tariffs and taxes on the importation of Chinese goods to the US. Without it's largest buyer, China would be in as much trouble as we would. The "People's" Party may not enjoy the fact that the US treats with the Dali Lama, but it knows which side it's bread is buttered on.[/QUOTE]

but unlike the rest of the world, China is big on pride and if you hurt their pride, they don't forget and will remember in the future. Yea my people are stupid like that sometimes.

 

[Espy]

 

[GasBandit]

If the President continues his plan to see the Dalai Lama, China may refuse to buy anymore U.S. debt and thus U.S. won't have the money they need to do their pet projects. I think that is where the president might balk a little since he really need that money to turn U.S. economy around. (that is my opinion)

To which we would respond by imposing harsh tariffs and taxes on the importation of Chinese goods to the US. Without it's largest buyer, China would be in as much trouble as we would. The "People's" Party may not enjoy the fact that the US treats with the Dali Lama, but it knows which side it's bread is buttered on.[/QUOTE]

but unlike the rest of the world, China is big on pride and if you hurt their pride, they don't forget and will remember in the future. Yea my people are stupid like that sometimes.[/QUOTE]

Historically, they have been rather eager to cut off their nose to spite their face, so to speak.

 

[Chibibar]

If the President continues his plan to see the Dalai Lama, China may refuse to buy anymore U.S. debt and thus U.S. won't have the money they need to do their pet projects. I think that is where the president might balk a little since he really need that money to turn U.S. economy around. (that is my opinion)

To which we would respond by imposing harsh tariffs and taxes on the importation of Chinese goods to the US. Without it's largest buyer, China would be in as much trouble as we would. The "People's" Party may not enjoy the fact that the US treats with the Dali Lama, but it knows which side it's bread is buttered on.[/QUOTE]

but unlike the rest of the world, China is big on pride and if you hurt their pride, they don't forget and will remember in the future. Yea my people are stupid like that sometimes.[/QUOTE]

Historically, they have been rather eager to cut off their nose to spite their face, so to speak.[/QUOTE]

Many Asian (Chinese, Japan, Korean etc etc) still follow the old "saving face" They rather go broke but keep their rep and "honor" in place. Sadly my family is like that too especially the older generation. Me? I do what is good for the whole group rather than worry about "saving my face" If I have to be shame, but my family will be ok, then so be it.

 

[@Li3n]

And by kill off you mean it literally... the social unrest would probably be the biggest trouble for China. But like i said, the US would be more screwed.

But to make it clear, the US wouldn't need to cut of trade, if China really took their debts back the US market would very likely die on it's own.

 

[Green_Lantern]

It does not feel so good to be the colony now and not the imperialist.

who is laughing now? Nelson is!