[Rant] Can we please stop this "is she a REAL geek lol" bullshit?

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Dirona

Dirona

Bubble181 said:
Note that I'm talking in general now, not just about women or some such. I don't think that's a really meaningful difference on this.
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And that's where I think your wrong, and where you've missed the point of Droll's original post. There is a difference between how male and female geeks/nerds (whatever) are assessed. There is also a difference in how they are treated (see Dei's comment), but I think that's a different issue.

The most recent blow-up re: Felicia Day is one example, but most of the female gamers on the board (myself included) can probably give you examples of being "tested" exclusively by geeky male collegues to see if they fit in, and futhermore that they have not seen that same degree of grilling administered to those with different plumbing. That I think, is the main point here; and I would agree that that difference does exist and that it does not add anything to geek culture (if we accept that as being a thing), or the geek community - be it on the internet as a whole or within a particular sub-group.

Edit for ninjas - also what Tress just said.
 
LittleKagsin

LittleKagsin

I feel bad that my opinion on this has gone from 'I'm so mad, Y U JUDGE ME??' to 'I really don't care'.

While the article does make me upset, very VERY upset, I'm so over the 'real geek vs. geek' debate. I can't speak for anyone but myself and for me it doesn't bother me much the influx of people wanting to be called geeks or be in to geeky things. I'm with HowDroll, it's a chance to share common interests and to make new friends! And if someone is faking it...they're easy to spot, just like Dave said. I also think, if they really aren't interested in geek things..they'll lose interest and disappear. No harm, no foul.

Because I was picked on all through out school, I have a pretty steep 'I try to never judge anyone ever' policy. I don't want to perpetuate the behaviour that everyone else seems to deem necessary to use.

Even if I was questioned about my true geek, and was found fake, I'd still like what I like. I'd still run home to play video games with my husband. I'd still sprint to the fabric store to make fun costumes. I would still bike to the comic book store to see what's new in stock. My actions aren't based on someone's opinion of me, so..I'm not to bothered by it. Sure, it makes me sad that a group of people who were generally the outcasts and bullied in school are now taking a more..elitist route. And I hope people can figure it out. I've always thought that every stranger you meet is a chance to make a friend, so instead of quizzing them, I want to find common ground.

I feel like I never make sense when I give opinions on here...bleh!

Regardless...I love you guys and want you to know, I've never felt threatened on here or felt like Iwas being looked down upon for being female. :)

EDIT: One more thing, I've always found it easier if I'm honest or upfront about what I like and don't like. If I try to lie my way around a subject, people can normally tell and call me on it. But if I just say 'Oh, haven't watched that.' Or 'Oh, I didn't read that comic, tell me more about it!'. It goes over much better.
Maybe if people did something similar geeks in general wouldn't feel like a bunch of women are trying to gain attention and encroach on something that they love.
 
Dirona

Dirona

I get the 'I'm so over it' stance Kag's, I really do. But I can't help but still get pissed off (or at the very least, somewhat irked) when the apparent 'entry requirements' to geekdom are a) different depending on your gender and b) rigidly enforced (I like the idea that we can all be nerds of whatever flavour together!).

Possibly preceisely because a fair number of geeks come from the not-so-popular crowd, we are still attuned to what others things of us, and even if we will still be geeks in our own minds, to be bullied by what we feel is our own community is particularly painful. It is also totally unnecessary - and that's what I get annoyed about.
 
Cajungal

Cajungal

Staff member
I thought part of getting past adolescence was having a personality that is not one of the one-word labels in a teen movie. I mean, I know that culture is a big part of some people's identity, but hopefully there is more to you than one word. And if people who have nothing more fulfilling to do with their time start questioning this tiny facet of who you are... well the truth is that they're probably a waste of space anyway. And who cares what a waste of space thinks?
 
Bubble181

Bubble181

Dirona said:
And that's where I think your wrong, and where you've missed the point of Droll's original post. There is a difference between how male and female geeks/nerds (whatever) are assessed. There is also a difference in how they are treated (see Dei's comment), but I think that's a different issue.
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Why can people not just read what I write? I wrote I don't think this is a meaningful difference. I don't care if other people think it is, or whatever. I'll gladly agree a lot of male geeks are complete idiots who are incapable of looking at a woman and seeing an actual person. I didn't say nobody thinks it's a difference. I said I don't think it's an interesting difference. I don't know whether half of the people on this board are male or female! I don't care! Other people can be asshats all they want, I wasn't talking about them. I was talking about my opinion, which is that, male or female, nerds tend to be nicer. This has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not female geeks get more/less/equal amounts of "cred, whether or not females are being treated equally, or whatever else. I'm voicing my opinion that it doesn't matter whether you're male or female. You won't get any more or less demands of proof of your nerdiness depending on your gender (which is not necessarily related to your plumbing) from me.

Why is it people feel the need to take what I write and spin it completely the opposite way? If nobody thought this was an issue, we wouldn't be having this thread. We are, so obviously some people think it matters. Good for them. Or not, as the case may be, because it makes them sexist pricks, but anyway. I'm just saying I think it shouldn't be an issue. There are far more important things to discriminate on. People who think Voyager was the best Star Trek, for example. Now those need to be taken outside.
 
LittleKagsin

LittleKagsin

I think it's great that people have that spark and intensity that I don't have. Especially with something like this where there is reason to be annoyed and upset, I'm just not one of them. You go Dirona! :)

And for me, I'm sure another factor is that I keep a pretty low profile, I mean, yeah, I cosplay, but really I try to not be in the forefront ever. So because of that, I personally dont' get bullied often. I never learned how to fight back, per se, I learned to ignore. And it's just what I do.

I'm glad, though, that there are awesome women who are feisty enough to take a vocal stand on this issue.

If I ever felt the need to do so, I would. But for this, and right now? I just don't at this time.
 
Bubble181

Bubble181

Also, I'm out. I can already tell this is yet another thread where people will joyfully misinterpret what I say until they can paint me as a misogynist/rape apologist/anti-women/whatever, and I'm frankly quite sick of it.

This board has some weird ways of having a conversation.
 
Tress

Tress

Bubble181 said:
Also, I'm out. I can already tell this is yet another thread where people will joyfully misinterpret what I say until they can paint me as a misogynist/rape apologist/anti-women/whatever, and I'm frankly quite sick of it.

This board has some weird ways of having a conversation.
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I'm not saying I think you're a mysogynist/anti-women/whatever. But consider this: if everyone always seems to misinterpret what you say, across different threads, across different days and weeks, maybe you should think about how clearly you are communicating. Which is easier to believe: everyone misinterprets what you say, or that you aren't doing an effective job at expressing your position accurately?
 
WasabiPoptart

WasabiPoptart

Bubble181 said:
I'll answer that question, Droll, if you answer me another one.

Why/how is it, that geek girls only seem to come in two varieties? The same is, up to a point, true for male geeks as well, but I find it much more pronounced in women. You have the ugly-fat-weat-stained-don't-want-to-go-near-with-a-ten-foot-pole type (who are usually awesome and very caring and fun), and you get the so-hot-it's-not-fair-they'-re-also-smart variety (who, in the case of those I know, when nerd, also turn out to be nice. Dammit! I do know why I always crush on geek girls, admittedly, it seems to be 90% of women who are smart, intelligent and hot at the same time are geeks :p).
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I had to reread this several times before I believed someone actually wrote this. Really? REALLY?!! Could you be more insulting?

And "geek girls", in my not so humble opinion, is a derogatory term. I am 40 years old. I am not a girl. My 3 year old is a girl. The term "geek girl" implies the female is immature, young, and some how less than a male geek.

I have more to say, but I am so incensed by this entire thing that I cannot put my thoughts on the page without sounding like a raging idiot troll.
 
Necronic

Necronic

Staff member
If women don't want to be treated differently from men then they need to accept that some geeks are going to go after any angle they can to try and feel superior to them/tear them down to protect their own shallow ego.

So, you know....deal with it.
 
Tress

Tress

Necronic said:
If women don't want to be treated differently from men then they need to accept that some geeks are going to go after any angle they can to try and feel superior to them/tear them down to protect their own shallow ego.

So, you know....deal with it.
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No, and that's bullshit. Women don't want to be treated differently, shouldn't have to be treated differently, and it's the morons that need to learn to deal with it.
 
Frank

Frank

Tress said:
No, and that's bullshit. Women don't want to be treated differently, shouldn't have to be treated differently, and it's the morons that need to learn to deal with it.
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What he's getting at is that geek 'men' do it to each other too.
 
S

SeraRelm

Let's put this to rest. Felicia Day is not a geek girl... She is a geek horse.

Carry on.
 
strawman

strawman

Necronic said:
[people] need to accept [abuse]
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That's a stupid thing to say, no matter how you slice and dice it, or limit it to particular groups on either end of the abuse.

Really, really dumb. No one should ever be told to sit down, shut up, and take it without complaint.
 
Covar

Covar

stienman said:
That's a stupid thing to say, no matter how you slice and dice it, or limit it to particular groups on either end of the abuse.

Really, really dumb. No one should ever be told to sit down, shut up, and take it without complaint.
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Bumble speaks the truth!
 
GasBandit

GasBandit

Staff member
Tress said:
I totally agree. I don't understand why this is even a thing. Why do we constantly try to evaluate women in geek culture? Why are we always trying to assess their credibility?
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Because a lot of dorks can't comprehend why someone they think has de facto instant access to sex on demand would want to partake in what they themselves use to cope with not having instant access to sex on demand.
 
Jay

Jay

Tress said:
No, and that's bullshit. Women don't want to be treated differently, shouldn't have to be treated differently, and it's the morons that need to learn to deal with it.
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rO0XW.gif


While I agree with you and many others in the thread, I will confidently state that this will never ever completely change because we tend to usually cope with others of the opposite sex. There may be at some point some type of superficial change over the years but the end result is pretty simple to see.

IMO, if Felicia Day was a dude named Felix Day with the exact same personality, the exact same intelligence, we wouldn't be talking about her. So in some ways, it's easier for one sex if you fall in a certain criteria and are looking for that sort of attention from your peers, sometimes is harder. That's just how the cookie crumbles and how it is. So, I can see where the article is coming from.... but not with the way it was thought out.

And I'll also confirm that we as humans we all have jealously, all have envy and all have doubt when certain others show up and have certain interests that are... out of the norm of what we expect of them (aka instant sex lol). Our uncertainties will always play a part.

Yet for me, I actually work in the exact opposite way. I completely embrace those who don't fall in a certain criteria like a certain subject that might be considered "geeky", not that's it's an actual term to describe someone as an activity/subject is an activity/subject that person might particularly be fond of can be something that can attributed to many different people or different ages, sexes, social standings... etc.

For example, I love star wars, yet I have friends who hate it but like other geek stuff like Star Trek. So, there's no total geeks or partial geeks, we just like different things.

However, I will boldly state that sometimes Felicia Day... can be considered... too much. That's just me though.
 
GasBandit

GasBandit

Staff member
stienman said:
Interesting assertion.
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Betty Childs, Pi-Delta-Pi: [blissfully] Oh, Stan. You were wonderful. You did things to me you've never done before.
[Lewis takes off his mask]
Betty Childs, Pi-Delta-Pi: [gasps] Ahhh! You're that NERD!
Lewis: Yeah.
Betty Childs, Pi-Delta-Pi: [blissfully] Oh, you were wonderful. [gasps in ecstacy] Are all nerds as good as you?
Lewis: Yes.
Betty Childs, Pi-Delta-Pi: How come?
Lewis: 'Cause all Jocks ever think about is sports, all nerds ever think about is sex.
 
strawman

strawman

I suspect some people are conflicted with Felecia because she actively uses her geekiness to promote herself and her professional career.

It's really no different than me doing so and getting extra consulting jobs because I know esoteric stuff about computers and electronics that are intesting to my potential clients.

Because she does her professional openly in the public eye, she's going to get more loud mouthed haters than I will.

Most of my haters don't have the time to complain about my methods or geekiness, they are struggling to get their project done on time and under budget. :D
 
SpecialKO

SpecialKO

What I am taking away from this discussion is that there are apparently so many hot geeky-appearing girls out there that there is a purist backlash against it just to deal with the overflow.

Which really just means that I've been hanging out in all the wrong places. :(
 
Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

When a girl says she's a gamer, and then says she only plays Call of Duty, I don't stare at her in scorn because she's a woman. I do it because she only plays CoD. To treat her differently would be sexist.


(this is a joke, I don't actually judge people for how they spend their leisure time... At least not to their face)
 
Necronic

Necronic

Staff member
Frank said:
What he's getting at is that geek 'men' do it to each other too.
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This is exactly what I am saying, and I should have put it that way.

The point is that, why does anyone care what these people think? Their opinions are clearly terrible and poorly concieved, they are the lowest common denominator of the mouthbreather genus. The only reason I care about what they think is that some people occasionally mistake me for one of them because I play computer games obsessively.
 
strawman

strawman

I don't judge people for how they spend their video game dollars, but I do judge people who judge people for how they spend their video game dollars.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
LittleKagsin said:
Regardless...I love you guys and want you to know, I've never felt threatened on here or felt like Iwas being looked down upon for being female. :)
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You have no idea how good that makes me feel. We've striven to make this a place where everyone is welcome, whether they are gay, straight, white, black, male, female, etc. Do we always get to the level I'd like to see? No. But we try. I can't remember the last time someone made a discriminatory remark and wasn't called out on it. Sometimes we even go too far the other way in trying NOT to offend...and that offends some.

But to see a very real statement by someone who on other sites might be totally creeped on & creeped out, well, that makes me feel good.

Keep up the good work, HF.
 
Jay

Jay

Dave said:
You have no idea how good that makes me feel. We've striven to make this a place where everyone is welcome, whether they are gay, straight, white, black, male, female, etc. Do we always get to the level I'd like to see? No. But we try. I can't remember the last time someone made a discriminatory remark and wasn't called out on it. Sometimes we even go too far the other way in trying NOT to offend...and that offends some.

But to see a very real statement by someone who on other sites might be totally creeped on & creeped out, well, that makes me feel good.

Keep up the good work, HF.
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