[Question] Grad School Preperation

[Bowielee]

So, I'll be finishing up my undergrad next year, and have already started looking at grad schools for Ph.D. programs in Psychology.

Do any of you doctoral-types have any advice for the upcoming year for increasing my chances of getting admitted into a grad school program?

I'm starting to get really worried as I'm planning on going into Social Psychology, which is a really competetive field right now.

Basically, my situation right now is that I have a 3.45 GPA with a 3.89 GPA in my major (Psychology, obviously). I've done 2 independent research projects as an undergrad (my current one appears to have significant results so far). I'm taking GRE prep courses this summer and will be taking the GRE in August. My preliminary tests put me in the 64th percentile for verbal, 53rd percentile for math (this was pre test prep, so I expect these to improve quite a bit).

So, with all that taken into account, I'm just scared that I'm wasting my time and I'll be left with a useless BS degree in psychology (any degree less than a masters in psychology won't get you much of anything).

I'm both looking for advice on any steps I should be taking and also possible assurances that I at least have a shot of getting into a grad school.

Also, because I like to have contingency plans, I will be applying to both Masters and PhD programs, but I'd prefer to go right for the doctorate.

I just met with a couple of professors at Univeristy of Minnesota: Twin Cities and MAN do I want to go there. They are doing work that completely fits with my current research projects and they were just a pleasure to talk to, but they have a 4% acceptance rate for their program.

Putting out the MindDetective call as he's the most familiar with the field.

 

[ThatNickGuy]

Useless advice for levity purposes from someone who can't give legitimate advice on this:

Just ask yourself, "What would Freud do?"

Wait, no. That's probably a bad idea.

 

[Hooty Hoo]

Gee, there used to be this really awesome guy around here with his PhD, that knew the ins and outs of most graduate programs. Shame.

 

[Bowielee]

Guess I'll just have to settle for the other five or six who aren't complete buttholes.

BTW, Hi, Chaz.

 

[fade]

My number one advice (on the way out the door right now) is this: It's not as hard as you think to get into grad school.

Let me rephrase. It's not all that difficult to get into a graduate program unless you're applying to an ivy league school. Hell at the university I worked at, we were actually kind of desperate for grad students. Your GPA is not bad at all, so as long as you have a good GRE, you will be fine. They likely won't give more than a passing glance at your research experience. Your potential advisor will, but probably not the admissions committee.

 

[Hoopty hoo]

You of all people should appreciate butthole advice. But yeah Fades right on the money. Your GPA is great. Whats great is your research experience. GREs are easy, like SAT part. 2. prep for an exhaustingly long interview process. youre going to prolly speak to about 10 profs in one day... im
on

my phone but ill be back to elaborate. more on that

 

[HowDroll]

Ooh, ooh! This is my area of expertise (as I happen to work in graduate admissions at the University of Missouri and am also a grad student here, albeit not in Psychology.)

Your GPA is pretty good; your overall GPA might be a touch on the low side of the average I've seen, but your major GPA is probably a bit above average, so it'll probably even itself out at most schools. I know a lot of universities (Mizzou included) weigh the last 60 credit hours you completed more heavily, so if your grades improved as you went along, you might even be in better shape than you think.

My scores improved a LOT from the preliminary tests I took online (from 500-ish Q/V to 710V/760Q), and I didn't even take my way through a test-prep course -- I just worked through a study guide. You should be in even better shape than me if you're taking a course. I don't know how recently you've taken math -- I hadn't taken anything but an introductory stats course since my junior year of high school, so I had to rely on the review in the book -- but what I found to be super helpful for the verbal section was to make flashcards on my smartphone and spend an hour or two every day working through them. (I found the verbal section of the GRE to be much more esoteric than the SAT's -- I actually received the same overall score on the SAT, but a 770V/700Q split instead. I found it quite funny that I did better on Quantitative than Verbal on the GRE, considering my background as an English major and lack of recent math courses, but it got me into the Information Science program here, so there you go.) There a ton of lists with the most frequently-used GRE words online, and you might also be able to find a good app with the words already plugged in. I did this for about two weeks before the test and bumped my score 200 points, so you might want to consider doing something similar.

It sounds like you're on the right track if you're meeting with professors. Find people with similar research interests, familiarize yourself with their work, and introduce yourself by email. Some will reply, but some won't, so don't get discouraged -- lots of professors are sucky at replying to emails, even about really important shit. You want them going to bat for you, or at least recognizing your name, when the committee meets. Also, have lots of people review your statement of purpose/resume; if you post it here, I'm sure you'll get some good feedback, or if you don't feel comfortable doing that feel free to send it my way. I'd be happy to critique it for you.

The single biggest piece of advice I have for you, though, is to GET YOUR SHIT IN EARLY. Transcripts get lost, especially when admissions offices are dealing with thousands of applications in a single month, and you don't want to find out you have to send a second set the day before the deadline. DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT wait until a few days before (or god forbid, the night before) the application deadline to submit your application and request your transcripts. Seriously. Don't do it. The very, very minimum I would recommend is ten to fifteen business days before the deadline, but if you want to sleep better at night, submit everything a month before and then double-check with your program/the admissions office to be sure everything was received two weeks before. That way, when crazy shit happens, you have plenty of time to get it fixed. Programs who have lots of applicants are just looking for reasons to disqualify people, and not having everything in before the deadline is the quickest way to the reject pile.

Mizzou doesn't offer a terminal master's degree in Psychology, so I've only seen applicants to the PhD program here and have set my standards accordingly, but from what I can tell it seems you have a pretty good shot at getting into a decent program. Good luck

 

[Bowielee]

Awesome advice, HowDroll .

As far as deadlines go, I'm kind of obsessive about them, so I'll most likely be getting my stuff in WAY before the deadline. The biggest pain in the ass (and expense) is going to be getting the transcripts from the 2 colleges I attended before UWS. Also, for the record, my cumulative GPA for just this university is 3.79. The only reason my overall GPA is so low is because of the first time I went to college, like 16 years ago. I was fresh out of high school and extremely stupid about managing, well, anything, so I have a semester of Cs and Ds that I've been burying for the past 3 years.

 

[HowDroll]

We see that ALL the time, and it's never really been a big deal -- and that's mostly why a lot of schools only look at the last 60 credit hours/2 years. Nobody with half of a brain thinks that a student's grades in his/her first semester of college are indicative of potential graduate school performance.

 

[MindDetective]

*cracks knuckles*

Ok, I'm just going to list out my advice for easy referencing.

1.) This is the most important, which is why I list it first. You are applying to the professor, not to the school. The school matters obviously, so consider the program, but look for people you want to work with as your number one factor. Once you find a person you want to work with and contact them directly via e-mail. Strike up a conversation about their research, whether they are accepting new grad students into their lab, and what they are working on. You want them to remember your name, so make it a real conversation.

2.) Apply to about 10+ programs. Set aside the money to pay for all of those fees.

3a.) I highly recommend applying nationwide and not just to the places that are close to home. A Ph.D. in social psychology means you are headed for an academic position. An academic position means your choices in where you live are dependent on which universities are hiring when you graduate. Get used to the idea that where you live is not as important as what you want to do. You might get lucky and live some place you really would like to (I did, eventually!!). But if you limit your options to just local schools you will either not get in, get a degree you aren't really interested in (because maybe you settled for a master's in Zzzzzz), or ended up in a program that is not suited for you. Discard the notion that location is an option and you will dramatically increase your odds at getting in. UMN is extremely competitive. Apply there but disperse your expectations across as many schools as you can afford/handle applying to.

3b.) Seriously consider some programs that are in places you wouldn't have thought to apply, like Kansas or Oklahoma. Some of those schools are desperate for out-of-state students. They want some diversity in their students and many of them come from other schools in the same state. They can offer you a good education but it means living in Kansas or Oklahoma. It is only temporary, though. I didn't like living in Reno when I was getting my degree (at a school, by the way, that many people don't think to apply to!) but I knew I would be leaving eventually. As a brief aside, you'll find that your training at a particular school prepares you to teach at a level below that school. Ivy league education leads you to teach at good schools, but not Ivy League (they usually poach experienced people) and state schools prepare you to teach at smaller state schools or liberal arts schools, etc. Keep that in mind as you set your expectations for post-graduate school.

4.) This ties in to number 1. If you can attend a conference (like Psychonomic Society, which is in Minneapolis in November. MPA has already met this year, I think, and often has a lot of Social Psych folks there) you can meet with prospective graduate mentors face-to-face. This strategy got one of my students into a Ph.D. program. Her GRE scores were lower than they would have liked but he was impressed enough with her that they accepted her in spite of them. Her mentor actually called me to discuss this. She is thriving there. Remember, applying to grad school is all about setting yourself apart from the other candidates. If all they have is your GPA, CV, and GRE scores, they will rely on only those things to make their decision. And most of the other candidates will meet the basic requirements and probably have some research experience like you. Let your potential mentors know you are eager and able.

5.) Your research experience is good. Emphasize that in your personal statement. Try to have recommenders that do so as well. Attending a conference like I described above demonstrates this further. Contacting potential mentors does so too. Aside from that, writing your persona statement is your only chance to demonstrate your writing ability. Have people read it and re-read it. Write it using specific events and examples, not vague or trite generalities. Write your personal statement as if you were writing an APA style manuscript. You are citing specific examples from your experiences that demonstrate you are a capable and eager student. Don't tell them, show them.

6.) A graduate mentor wants an able and eager worker, not a student. You are going to help them with their research and possibly their teaching as well. They want someone they can use. If I recall, you have some computer programming experience. Emphasize this! Sell your skills as a worker bee to them. Let their imagination take over as they envision all of the research they can accomplish with your abilities.

7.) Be persistent. I didn't get in the first year that I applied (partly because I only applied to three schools). I almost didn't get in anywhere the second time around (thank goodness for the school people don't think to apply to!) In times of recession, graduate applications go up, so competition will be stiffer. But experimental and social psych programs are less competitive than clinical programs. If you do your homework, if you bug enough professors, if you cast your net wide enough, your odds of getting in will be very good. I would say 80% chance, at least, possibly better, if you stick with it.

I'm sure I've forgotten some things, but if anything else leaps to mind, I'll come back and post. Naturally, ask if you have any questions!

 

[Bowielee]

I have absolutely no ties to any specific place, so I'll be applying nationwide.

I'll be applying to 10-15 colleges.

 

[HowDroll]

3b.) Seriously consider some programs that are in places you wouldn't have thought to apply, like Kansas or Oklahoma. Some of those schools are desperate for out-of-state students. They want some diversity in their students and many of them come from other schools in the same state. They can offer you a good education but it means living in Kansas or Oklahoma. It is only temporary, though.

This is good advice.

Speaking as someone who had to move from one of the most fabulous cities in the world (Chicago) to bumblefuck Missouri so my partner and I could attend grad school here, it was NOT as bad as I thought. I thought living in the middle of a cornfield was going to completely suck, but Columbia has really grown on me; lots of the bigger college towns really have their charms (not to mention are liberal oases in a sea of Bible Belt hicks). I'm really hoping to move back to Chicago next year when he finishes his Ph.D. and I have my master's, but living here isn't at all intolerable.

Don't go to Kansas, though. Only assholes go to KU

 

[Bowielee]

I dunno, as I get closer to finishing my undergrad, I keep wondering when people are going to notice that I'm really an idiot. I'm starting to think that I may not be one.

 

[Ravenpoe]

I dunno, as I get closer to finishing my undergrad, I keep wondering when people are going to notice that I'm really an idiot. I'm starting to think that I may not be one.

Never underestimate your own idiocy, that way it can never surprise you.

 

[MindDetective]

I dunno, as I get closer to finishing my undergrad, I keep wondering when people are going to notice that I'm really an idiot. I'm starting to think that I may not be one.

That is still true even when you graduate with your Ph.D. You'll feel like you conned someone.

 

[ThatNickGuy]

I dunno, as I get closer to finishing my undergrad, I keep wondering when people are going to notice that I'm really an idiot. I'm starting to think that I may not be one.

Just keep tricking them, all the way to a PhD. After all, it just stands for "Piled Higher and Deeper."

 

[WasabiPoptart]

I have to bookmark this for when I start looking into Psy.D. programs in a couple of years. So glad you asked this question BowieLee!

 

[fade]

That is still true even when you graduate with your Ph.D. You'll feel like you conned someone.

There's an xkcd for this.

Every PhD ever from Einstein to Feynman to you secretly thinks they are way behind in their field, and that everyone around them knows more than they do.

 

[Necronic]

The funny thing for me is that most fo the PhD's I've worked for would never admit that there's something they don't know (or if they didn't know it it is either irrelevant or simple.) Having one of them say that about a pretty advanced database I built (while talking about how he could do the same with Excel), made me smile.

(I have nothing against PhD's. They have ridiculous work ethics and really are at the top of their field. I'm just astounded by the ego's some of them have.)

 

[IronBrig4]

Make sure you contact a professor who specializes in your particular focus. Tell them about your work because they can often be the difference between acceptance and rejection.