Gas Bandit's Political Thread V: The Vampire Likes Bats

B

BErt

Picture caption: "Pack of Dachshunds"
Video voice over: "mauled by a pack of Dachshunds"
article, waaaaay down below the fold, "These aren't actually dachshunds."

JOURNALISM :facepalm:

This terrible misrepresentation of dachshunds is the sole responsibility of the fake news media pro-corgi bias.
 

figmentPez

Staff member
Ran across this Unpopular Opinion Puffin on Imgur:
UOP Public Education Should Not Exist.jpg

Source
The caption was "It also seems wrong to force people to pay for other people's education through taxation. Wavers and most charter schools, therefore, seem like bad ideas as well."

Just the other day I was wondering why public education isn't attacked as socialism. The answer occurred to me that the public education system primarily serves to create obedient workers for factories and offices, and thus is actually capitalism gaming the system, but apparently some people think capitalism isn't getting enough out of the system and want to get rid of it. As flawed as the public education system is, I still think it's better than the alternative.

My response was "I suppose you're against vaccination, too? Like 'herd immunity', educating everyone helps prevent the devastating effects of stupidity."

And later I noted that those market forces haven't done any good for colleges. Prices for higher education, especially private schools, has risen explosively.
 
And later I noted that those market forces haven't done any good for colleges. Prices for higher education, especially private schools, has risen explosively.
I think you mean colleges have maximized profits exponentially, as per the tenets of free market capitalism...

And we even have affordability, represented by low quality schools that offer "slightly" less quality degrees... the post-smartphone-Nokia's of colleges.
 
And later I noted that those market forces haven't done any good for colleges. Prices for higher education, especially private schools, has risen explosively.
Isn't that at least partially because your students, as a population, have turned into a risk-free investment vehicle? Student loans are attractive to lenders and schools AFAIK, since they can't be discharged in bankruptcy except through adversarial/undue hardship weirdness, are given out like candy, and both the subsidized and unsubsidized ones are guaranteed by the federal government.

I've never researched this, so I may be looking at the wrong end of an egg-and-chicken problem, but maybe if your students weren't cash cows your schools wouldn't be milking sheds.
 
The price of higher education is rising, while the actual product is being devalued. The whole system is out of wack because society decided that it needed everyone to go to college and get a college degree (in part because of how meaningless a HS diploma is). So demand exploded, traditional schools can raise their prices as their supply remains limited, and to fill those gaps we get diploma mills. Eventually the college degree will become as commoditized and meaningless as a HS diploma, and the whole market will crash.
 
the public education system primarily serves to create obedient workers for factories and offices, and thus is actually capitalism gaming the system.
Under Capitalism, Industry will never turn down an opportunity to gain advantage when it is on someone else’s dime.
I suppose you're against vaccination, too? Like “herd immunity,” educating everyone helps prevent the devastating effects of stupidity.
While this may be the image they want to portray, I will never believe this until the day I see this mandatory* education include actual, useful life skills beyond the usual token “Home Ec” class that barely teaches you the difference between dill and sweet pickle relish.
And yes, I’m hella bitter about this. If I’d had more of some basic life skills training before college, I could’ve entirely short cut at least 10 years of misery. But of course if you are taught how to project your own finances, cook your own food, shop for goods based on value rather than price, etc., then fewer people would probably even go to college once they realize how much of a rip-off it has become.

—Patrick
*Seriously, they will take away your kids if you can’t prove they’re getting an “approved” education.
 
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figmentPez

Staff member
While this may be the image they want to portray, I will never believe this until the day I see this mandatory* education include actual, useful life skills beyond the usua token “home ec” class that barely teaches you the difference between dill and sweet pickle relish.
I agree with you. I don't think we're actually doing a good job of education, on the whole. There are some schools, some teachers, who are doing a better job than others, but on the whole the system is lacking. However, I still think we need to try for better public education, because it benefits everyone for the populace to be educated.
 
Some things though, such as making food, are probably things that are expected to be learned at home, since eating is essential to survival. Most kids can follow a simple recipe by the time they are 10. However, part of the problem with things like cooking is engrained gender role in society, because most (not all) people I see who are in their 20s and 30s and still can't figure out how a stove works are men.
 

figmentPez

Staff member
Most kids can follow a simple recipe by the time they are 10.
Based on my friends, this is not true. The majority didn't know how to follow anything more complicated than the instructions on a frozen meal (and some not even that) until they were out of high school. I wonder if anyone has statistics on this.
 
Based on my friends, this is not true. The majority didn't know how to follow anything more complicated than the instructions on a frozen meal (and some not even that) until they were out of high school. I wonder if anyone has statistics on this.
Having the capacity to follow directions is something kids learn early. Most of the time, it's more about not being open to following directions *of a certain type* that holds people back. Be that fear of fucking up, or just not wanting to bother, I can't say. Some cooking is, in fact, complicated. But being able to boil water and throw noodles in until a timer dings is not complex.
 
Isn't that at least partially because your students, as a population, have turned into a risk-free investment vehicle? Student loans are attractive to lenders and schools AFAIK, since they can't be discharged in bankruptcy except through adversarial/undue hardship weirdness, are given out like candy, and both the subsidized and unsubsidized ones are guaranteed by the federal government.

I've never researched this, so I may be looking at the wrong end of an egg-and-chicken problem, but maybe if your students weren't cash cows your schools wouldn't be milking sheds.
Skyrocketing tuition is almost exclusively accounted for by states defunding colleges.
 
The price of higher education is rising, while the actual product is being devalued. The whole system is out of wack because society decided that it needed everyone to go to college and get a college degree (in part because of how meaningless a HS diploma is). So demand exploded, traditional schools can raise their prices as their supply remains limited, and to fill those gaps we get diploma mills. Eventually the college degree will become as commoditized and meaningless as a HS diploma, and the whole market will crash.
Schools are not raising prices because demand is rising. In fact, schools are competing hard for students because there are more colleges now than there ever were before. The students are the ones in demand, not the colleges.
 

Dave

Staff member
It's dumb but they are the employer so they can do whatever they want. So instead of kneeling, raise a fist or stay in the locker room until it's over.
 
The funny thing is that staying in the locker room is still a protest...

And raising a fist is black terrorism, if i have my talking points right...
 

figmentPez

Staff member
Having the capacity to follow directions is something kids learn early. Most of the time, it's more about not being open to following directions *of a certain type* that holds people back. Be that fear of fucking up, or just not wanting to bother, I can't say. Some cooking is, in fact, complicated. But being able to boil water and throw noodles in until a timer dings is not complex.
I had a friend in high school who failed to make a Hot Pocket (well it was a Red Baron version of a pocket dinner). She put the whole thing, plastic and all, in the microwave. Not all my friends are this bad, but the majority would not be able to follow the instructions in a recipe (prior to having learned after high school). Actually, I know a lot of people who have trouble following instructions, period.

I know people who ask for help setting up a computer because they can't follow the instructions on a two page installation card. I know people who can't figure out how to connect up a home theater system if it's more complicated than two cables.

People learn to follow a procedure early in life, but that's a whole different thing from being able to follow instructions.
 
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I had a friend in high school who failed to make a Hot Pocket (well it was a Red Baron version of a pocket dinner). She put the whole thing, plastic and all, in the microwave. Not all my friends are this bad, but the majority would not be able to follow the instructions in a recipe (prior to having learned after high school). Actually, I know a lot of people who have trouble following instructions, period.

I know people who ask for help setting up a computer because they can't follow the instructions on a two page installation card. I know people who can't figure out how to connect up a home theater system if it's more complicated than two cables.

People learn to follow a procedure early in life, but that's a whole different thing from being able to follow instructions.
Yeah, and no amount of school is going to help them if they can't be bothered. All school is is a place to teach you to follow instructions.
 
My best teacher in high school summed it up quite nicely, I thought. "I'm not here to teach you science. I mean, I am here to teach you science, but really I'm here to teach you how to learn."
 
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