Dave, he already explained his situation in the article he quoted to support his position. The article demonstrates his assertion that we are supposed to care more about how he feels than about the subject being discussed.
--Patrick
Get the sand out of your vag (Seinfeld says colleges too PC)
- Thread starter Mathias
- Start date
--Patrick
I'd be really curious to see where the secondary meaning actually developed. The wiki article makes it seem like situation from the video below.
Of course I'm being fucking gross so we should just shut down all discussion on this matter. Or would if people like Charlie and the college students/tumblr crowd/Seinfeld's daughter were actually willing to have a dialog.
Necronic
Staff member
Jim Gaffigan. Pretty much the only people he might offend are those with IBS.
That's just because they don't have the stomach for that sort of humor.
My stomach's fine, dammit. Stop making a caricature of my life-defining invisible illness. Your "humor" isn't funny at all. Now excuse me while I go to the bathroom and I'll be back with a scathing remark in 5 to 10 minutes.
(I actually do have IBS so I can make jokes about it dammit!
)
I have an ulcer, you insensitive cad! You people with your still-mostly-intact stomach tissue can kiss my butt!(I actually do have IBS so I can make jokes about it dammit!
...Oooh, can I? Can I?
It's live art, which means there's some degree of leeway. For example, back when oral tradition storytelling was a bigger thing, the storyteller would lengthen the story if the audience was into it, cut it down if the audience wasn't enjoying it much. I'm not saying a comedian is ever going to be perfect, but let's take the Louis CK clip from earlier. When the audience started showing negativity, he knew how to diffuse it.
On the idea of people's speech, that's a more complex issue than is being given credit. On the one hand, people don't want to offend each other or even seem racist just by being descriptive. On the other hand, ignoring race is one step towards ignoring racism, which is bad. My personal opinion is that it's better for us to have differences and accept them than for us to become homogenous. But people have a harder time accepting differences than just saying "we're all the same."
On the comedy part, I'm sure there are political conservatives who would love to hear race jokes, but Seinfeld, Rock, others wouldn't want to cater to that crowd. Thing is, as they get older, their generation is going to become more out of touch with youth, and what was considered progressive at a time eventually isn't considered progressive enough. That's how it should be; otherwise we get decades of schools telling kids that Martin Luther King ended racism and nothing gets done--oh wait.
With that said, I think the situation has two sides. On the one hands, if a comedian's comedy is their art, they should be willing to do it. It's not like an unhappy college campus is going to ruin the careers of people like Jerry Seinfeld and Chris Rock. On the other hand, we all need to be a little offended sometimes not only so we can know how that feels, but why we feel that way.
On a side-note, goddammit Charlie, why are you so useless?[DOUBLEPOST=1433884436,1433884040][/DOUBLEPOST]Side-side-note, sometimes when a person says a joke "wasn't funny," it's not because they were offended; it's because they found it lacked humor/failed to amuse them. I think a lot of people don't understand that.
Only if you make a video and post it for my edification....Oooh, can I? Can I?
...did you watch the video?My stomach's fine, dammit. Stop making a caricature of my life-defining invisible illness. Your "humor" isn't funny at all. Now excuse me while I go to the bathroom and I'll be back with a scathing remark in 5 to 10 minutes.
(I actually do have IBS so I can make jokes about it dammit!
--Patrick
Don't say honeypot.
That's racist! Bears like honey.
One of many downsides of visiting this place mostly from work: no videos, no sound.
GasBandit
Staff member
I said, "can you blow me where the pampers is??"
I love that movie
*cuffs upside the head* Don't disparage the hat.
The hat has come to mean something more than its original, purely-hat roots.*cuffs upside the head* Don't disparage the hat.
Much like certain words.
Zappit
Staff member
I have one rule with my comedy. Only make fun of people who possess the capacity to crack back. I don't joke about people with mental disabilities.
If you look centuries back, the comedians have always helped to point out and mock humanities foibles and failings. In most Shakespeare plays, The Fool is often the only character really able to speak the truth about other characters or situations, often in a low-brow manner.
Jerry Seinfeld has a valid point about the Tumblr age crowd, because there are a tremendous number of simply insufferable, immature, petty people who actively harass and target the "offensive" humorists. A cartoonist who poked fun at SJWs was doxxed, and the SJWs bombarded her place of business with nasty calls until they fired her. One of many such acts of intellectual persecution. Congratulations are in order, because they all get a trophy for being Tremendous Assholes.
But it's nothing new. Humorists are always targets because there's very often a bit of truth to what they say and produce. If you read a blog called The Daily Cartoonist, you'll see many cases of foreign cartoonists jailed without cause or victimized by oppressive governments. Hell, look at what Lenny Bruce went through here just a few decades ago. It takes courage to stand up and be funny. The Hardcore SJW crowd is simply another oppressive ideological movement that seeks to suppress and limit speech it does not agree with. They want to represent the downtrodden, but take it to such an extreme level that they literally cannot mentally or emotionally handle ideas dissimilar to their own. Most of them will probably grow out of it in time, and might someday have a conversation like an adult. But right now, they're toxic.
Comedians had it easier in the 80's, 90's, and early 00's. There wasn't an ideological or political group that actively targeted them for their jokes to the extent we're currently seeing. They could get edgy. They could experiment. Thank God for that.
The thing that sickens me right to my core is that while the SJW crowd has a noble cause - seeking social equality and equal justice - it has been hijacked and perverted by a small but extraordinarily shrill group that bullies people into ideological extremism. No negotiation. No gray areas. No dissent. Silence your enemies. A number of them have openly stated that facts just get in the way, and should be dismissed of they dispute a selected narrative. We're now seeing college groups demanding trigger warnings on classic literature, and "safe zones" being erected when a potential controversial speaker gives a presentation. This goes beyond the pale. We're allowing these people to become intellectual hemophiliacs. I doubt they could comprehend the nuances of satire. The rest of the world doesn't give a shit about those kinds of concerns.
Free speech is a pillar of freedom, and I have no tolerance for those that seek to suppress it. Do I enjoy Rush Limbaugh's often racist rhetoric? No. Do I approve of Mike Huckabee's homophobic statements and hypocritical support of an admitted sex-offender? Not in the least. They have the right to spout off their nonsense. It's a right paid for by the blood of patriots, and it is a sacred right. Do I approve of Rick Santorum stating the Pope should shut his mouth about global warming? No way in hell do I support a man trying to take away another man's right to express an opinion. Fuck Rick Santorum.
I've heard plenty of offensive comedy, and read plenty of truly tasteless and offensive comics. They have their place, and we grow from them, one way or the other.
Sorry if that was long and ranty, but as a cartoonist and smart-ass, I'm pretty passionate about the sanctity of humor.
If you look centuries back, the comedians have always helped to point out and mock humanities foibles and failings. In most Shakespeare plays, The Fool is often the only character really able to speak the truth about other characters or situations, often in a low-brow manner.
Jerry Seinfeld has a valid point about the Tumblr age crowd, because there are a tremendous number of simply insufferable, immature, petty people who actively harass and target the "offensive" humorists. A cartoonist who poked fun at SJWs was doxxed, and the SJWs bombarded her place of business with nasty calls until they fired her. One of many such acts of intellectual persecution. Congratulations are in order, because they all get a trophy for being Tremendous Assholes.
But it's nothing new. Humorists are always targets because there's very often a bit of truth to what they say and produce. If you read a blog called The Daily Cartoonist, you'll see many cases of foreign cartoonists jailed without cause or victimized by oppressive governments. Hell, look at what Lenny Bruce went through here just a few decades ago. It takes courage to stand up and be funny. The Hardcore SJW crowd is simply another oppressive ideological movement that seeks to suppress and limit speech it does not agree with. They want to represent the downtrodden, but take it to such an extreme level that they literally cannot mentally or emotionally handle ideas dissimilar to their own. Most of them will probably grow out of it in time, and might someday have a conversation like an adult. But right now, they're toxic.
Comedians had it easier in the 80's, 90's, and early 00's. There wasn't an ideological or political group that actively targeted them for their jokes to the extent we're currently seeing. They could get edgy. They could experiment. Thank God for that.
The thing that sickens me right to my core is that while the SJW crowd has a noble cause - seeking social equality and equal justice - it has been hijacked and perverted by a small but extraordinarily shrill group that bullies people into ideological extremism. No negotiation. No gray areas. No dissent. Silence your enemies. A number of them have openly stated that facts just get in the way, and should be dismissed of they dispute a selected narrative. We're now seeing college groups demanding trigger warnings on classic literature, and "safe zones" being erected when a potential controversial speaker gives a presentation. This goes beyond the pale. We're allowing these people to become intellectual hemophiliacs. I doubt they could comprehend the nuances of satire. The rest of the world doesn't give a shit about those kinds of concerns.
Free speech is a pillar of freedom, and I have no tolerance for those that seek to suppress it. Do I enjoy Rush Limbaugh's often racist rhetoric? No. Do I approve of Mike Huckabee's homophobic statements and hypocritical support of an admitted sex-offender? Not in the least. They have the right to spout off their nonsense. It's a right paid for by the blood of patriots, and it is a sacred right. Do I approve of Rick Santorum stating the Pope should shut his mouth about global warming? No way in hell do I support a man trying to take away another man's right to express an opinion. Fuck Rick Santorum.
I've heard plenty of offensive comedy, and read plenty of truly tasteless and offensive comics. They have their place, and we grow from them, one way or the other.
Sorry if that was long and ranty, but as a cartoonist and smart-ass, I'm pretty passionate about the sanctity of humor.
Seinfeld notes that there are subjects he can't make funny, and so he doesn't touch them. That makes sense to me. However, granting that anything can be made funny, that doesn't mean anything can be made funny by just anyone. Comedians who fail in that shouldn't be rewarded with laughter they didn't earn.
I've mentioned before, but I've cut ties with a local acquaintance who was getting more and more toxic in her tumblr and twitter posts. For starters, she was one of those "I'm white but I hate white people" types. But the kicker was during the Baltimore riots, she was joining the mob to ruin the life of another girl who had posted some ill-advised racial tweets. That girl got doxxed, and the frothing mob actually declared it's intent to DESTROY HER LIFE (caps theirs.) At that point I wanted nothing more to do with her. It makes me think about all her other posts about how much she couldn't stand her jobs (lots of them), apartments (lots of them), towns she's lived in (lots of them), and other people.
Gee, didja ever stop to think YOU may be the toxic one, dear?
Gee, didja ever stop to think YOU may be the toxic one, dear?
I feel like many people watched a completely different clip than I did. Seinfeld never even said one way or the other how he personally felt about the issue because he doesn't need to work campuses anyway (he never really has in his career). He is just affirming that yes, he has heard this from other comedians who do work colleges.
Dave
Staff member
More comedians are coming out supporting Seinfeld and what he said.
Seth Meyers
Larry the Cable Guy
Colin Quinn
Lewis Black - I heard this this morning, but I didn't hear the quote so I may be wrong about him.
Again, these are experts in the field, agreeing with the stated point that colleges are too PC and comics are staying away.
Seth Meyers
Larry the Cable Guy
Colin Quinn
Lewis Black - I heard this this morning, but I didn't hear the quote so I may be wrong about him.
Again, these are experts in the field, agreeing with the stated point that colleges are too PC and comics are staying away.
Now just imagine doing standup in front of 300 Charlies.
I see this list, and if you include Seinfeld and Rock, I think there's a lot of truth in what @Zero Esc said:
No one is saying these guys aren't funny, but people under a certain age just aren't their primary audience anymore. And the same thing happened when they were up-and-coming: appealing to a younger audience with a different style of comedy. Comedy has, and does, change with the times. When was the last time you heard vaudeville acts or Henny Youngman-types finding a college audience? I'd really love some younger comics to weigh-in to see if they're having similar issues reaching an younger audience.
Cajungal
Staff member
For the record, I just wanna say that Larry the Cable Guy is absolutely not funny.
I'm not a fan of Daniel Whitney's ("Larry's" real name) act...but I take solace that it is just an act. He was a run-of-the-mill stand up performer until the popularity of that particular bit in his act took off. You can't blame the guy for capitalizing on it.
http://splitsider.com/2013/03/defending-larry-the-cable-guy/
The ironic thing is that the Larry redneck act was originally a bit mocking rednecks...and now he's stuck being one. Sad, really